Comments on: An important court win for Pima County cyclists!

By: Take the lane @ Arizona Bike Law Blog

Take the lane @ Arizona Bike Law Blog — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 15:42:40 +0000

[...] case; Arizona V. Piscopo, Pima County (see more generally at Two Abreastness. Also see the case at TBL, the blog of the lawyer who represented [...]

By: Tucson Bike Lawyer » Blog Archive » Another Appellate win for bicyclists in Pima County

Tue, 19 Jan 2010 00:53:42 +0000

[...] practicable to the right-hand side of the roadway.” This was a much more difficult case than the similar appeal we won last month, and I was concerned after our oral argument that we would not win this case. But I received the [...]

By: Mindy

Mindy — Mon, 21 Dec 2009 07:12:42 +0000

This is fantastic news! Thanks and a pat on the back to all involved.

By: BB

BB — Sun, 20 Dec 2009 23:35:19 +0000

here is the more of the ramp. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Af52ZpZHUcY. and http://tiny.cc/fqlbq google maps

I want don’t want to ride next to any guard rails. Nor do I want to have to merge into traffic by riding to the right.

I am not sure what shoulder your talking about. http://tiny.cc/fqlbq google has it as a bus pull out, and wider area ends in the “Wild West.”
FYI I was turning onto this road from “Wood st” headed northbound or left. So taking the lane seems rather real to me. Establish control early.

I think your missing the predictable point. If am traveling straight. I want to continue straight, so I don’t follow a path leading into, which is going to be right turn lane only. Here is another good video for that. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLzWqNkSCvQ Here I split traffic (you’ll love that) so Freeway traffic has a dedicated lane.

Many intersection widen and contract. Predictability comes into play. I am into the road widths after intersections where I am traveling to determine practical solutions.

By: Coghauler

Coghauler — Sun, 20 Dec 2009 22:23:48 +0000

Well gee, BB, I just don’t know…
isn’t there 3-4 feet of paved
shoulder to the right of the white
line. I’m looking at where the line ends.
A lighter colored asphalt extending over
to the dirt. Am I misinterpreting that?
I also see the truck’s rear tire on the
white left line. That means that a 7 foot
wide truck would be 5 feet from the right
edge of a 12 foot lane. Doesn’t that look
about right? If the cyclist is 2 feet to
the left of the line, the truck has given
3 feet. But would not practicable dictate
that the cyclist be closer to the white
line, especially if there is pavement to
the right of the line? Oh, and I only see
two lanes of traffic at this point. How
far down the road is the ramp? The video
is excellent, but I can’t really tell that.
Can’t debate what I can’t see.

By: BB

BB — Sat, 19 Dec 2009 22:26:07 +0000

@ Coghauler
I have a lot of video which could and does get debated (more specific link).
“This is why I have to debate BB’s positioning
in the roadway on the video in #7.” ##### This one’s for you! Hwy 60 through the Queen Creek tunnel. http://www.youtube.com/bodybait#p/u/39/guSDgFGIOAE turn off sound.

###
In my link video the road way ends with a white line, bus pullout.
Need to yes, it ends. You can also see by not taking the left side I was subject to improper pass by the truck. The people are trying to get on the freeway.

Further more need to YES.
In order to avoid the right hooks onto a free ramp. You would move all the way left facilitate passing on the right.

segment two is a urban narrow lane period. You pass on the left. My need you bet. I ride on the right tire track 95 percent of the time. Very few roads carry a 14 foot lane for too long to be practical.

By: Michael McKisson

Michael McKisson — Sat, 19 Dec 2009 21:14:44 +0000

I think the pavement in the first segment is actually a bus pullout an ends pretty quickly.

It seems to me, especially in segment #1, isn’t the safer option to ride down the center of the lane so that people can’t try to squeeze by?

By: Coghauler

Coghauler — Sat, 19 Dec 2009 19:15:53 +0000

I think the law’s use of the word
practicable illustrates the attempt
to acknowledge that judgement is
necessary in determining a rider’s
position on the road.
To say,”As far right as possible” does
not allow for adjustment to conditions.
To say, “As far right as practical”
introduces too much subjective leeway.
‘Feasible’ and ‘reasonable’ are even a
little weak for use in this instance
because they miss the sense of obligation
that practicable alludes to.
This is why I have to debate BB’s positioning
in the roadway on the video in #7. I am NOT
debating his right to be where he is but rather
his NEED to be where he is…is it practicable?
In the first segment, traffic is heavy and there
is 3-4 feet of paved shoulder that looks to be clear
and ridable. Why force the issue in that situation?
In the 2nd segment there is no allowance for bikes
and the pavement is not ideal. Given the dangers of
intersections, however, was he not obligated to contribute
to the safe negotiation of all by being further to the
right allowing for more vehicle clearance. The driver
should have followed and waited for him to relinquish
the lane (a real world fantasy), but an action on his part
could have made the pass legal. Doesn’t practicable impart
this sense of obligation to the rule?
Please keep in mind this comes from someone who has a
*BIKES* MAY USE FULL LANE sign transfered onto the back
of a riding shirt.

By: BB

BB — Sat, 19 Dec 2009 16:42:35 +0000

On another note,

Congrats TBL.
Stating the obvious of course. You’re a man ahead of your time.

This is also why the three foot law is so important. Even if it doesn’t have teeth. Video should be enough IMO Id’ing the driver is not my problem, go after the owner, who they allowed to drive, or who was driving themself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNOXWDfYS0Y

By: BB

BB — Sat, 19 Dec 2009 16:31:47 +0000

Tucson is getting bike lanes?

Orange Grove w
Congress by A MT.
919 s 10th ave small litte complete the street section.
They’re now already there. MUCTD code book thing also states you no longer need to use the “Bicycle Lane” sign in order to have a bike lane. You can use just the stencils and line.

Now Tucson is in a state of suspense. Are they going to be bike lanes or shoulders?

I love the current treatment “bike route” signs. But motorists haven’t a clue.